Forum Communication only contest

[Diws]

While I sympathize with much of what you are saying here, and as mentioned have stuck with anonymous games so far, you already said that you were planning on hitting me, and have posted some of my pop center info. So what am I to think? Yes i am unlikely to do much about it as the DE seems like he is not giving up on coming my way, and I detest the gang up scenario ( which was a problem in Fall of Rome to an extent and Which helped make team games w fixed allies the gold standard there).. plus I am an avid Hyborian War player and the regular games have a big ‘mega alliance ‘ issue ) . So there is a weakness in the format, potentially. That said, you did hit a kingdom with defense pacts, and if a kingdom were to not live up to the agreement it would be a severe and public black mark on the players honor.

[Diws]

As an example, what you could have done here would have been to by all means play up the 3-1, try and get the DE and the DA to put aside their differences (and check the DA nap pact timing with the IL, suggesting that they are next on the menu) and try and get the WA and NE involved. That kind of diplomatic maneuvering is built into the game , I think.

[PTRILEY]

This is so interesting as this is my first forum game too. I have alliances in this game but I also have defense pacts, but they are not mutual attack a kingdom pacts, only I will help defend you if I can pacts.. So my thought is, it must be ok to lose the game to the IL who now how’s two regions, even for his allies who will fall behind him in status points if he doesn’t lose the extra region? So allies are reserve on placing second or third in a game?

I’m curious on what the WA, SA and GN kingdoms thoughts are. As I know what has been posted here by the IL AN DA SO DU kingdoms. And I have not heard much at all from the DE kingdom either?

Necro King

[WARMASTER]

While I sympathize with much of what you are saying here, and as mentioned have stuck with anonymous games so far, you already said that you were planning on hitting me, and have posted some of my pop center info.  So what am I to think?  Yes i am unlikely to do much about it as the DE seems like he is not giving up on coming my way, and I detest the gang up scenario ( which was a problem in Fall of Rome to an extent and Which helped make team games w fixed allies the gold standard there).. plus I am an avid Hyborian War player and the regular games have a big ‘mega alliance ‘ issue ) .   So there is a weakness in the format, potentially.  That said, you did hit a kingdom with defense pacts, and if a kingdom were to not live up to the agreement it would be a severe and public black mark on the players honor.

I was NOT going to hit you, Diws.  I was going to hit the AN (increased regional reaction, remember?) to even the odds for the SO.  But on the turn I planned to move against the AN the SO struck an agreement and the hostilities ended.  There was, therefore, no further reason to assist the SO.

But at the same time the DE indicated that the IL hit him (claiming IL did so before their NAP expired).  The IL then blatantly lied about doing so.  Since the DE is one of our newer players and the IL is one of our most experienced players I thought to assist the DE by hitting the IL.

Also, as NE player just said, I couldn't sit passively and allow the IL to gain a second region after spending the entire contest with a region containing the income of 2 cities and simply be content doing nothing in my corner.

Do "defense pacts" continue when a player becomes the aggressor?  IL thinks so.  He is free to attack anywhere he pleases and rely upon his vassals to defend him?  That is a seriously imbalanced game.  I have no interest in playing in such a contest in the future.  Apparently, that is par for the course in full diplomacy?  We shall see!

[PTRILEY]

Also, as NE player just said, I couldn't sit passively and allow the IL to gain a second region after spending the entire contest with a region containing the income of 2 cities and simply be content doing nothing in my corner.

Do "defense pacts" continue when a player becomes the aggressor?  IL thinks so.  He is free to attack anywhere he pleases and rely upon his vassals to defend him?  

Not mine, if you are the aggressor then you must reap what you sow.   And I don’t expect any support if I become the aggressor on a one on one fight...  I thought these defense alliance were in place to protect kingdoms from being targeted by many at once..  we live and learn..

Necro

[IMPERIAL_TARK]

While I sympathize with much of what you are saying here, and as mentioned have stuck with anonymous games so far, you already said that you were planning on hitting me, and have posted some of my pop center info.  So what am I to think?  Yes i am unlikely to do much about it as the DE seems like he is not giving up on coming my way, and I detest the gang up scenario ( which was a problem in Fall of Rome to an extent and Which helped make team games w fixed allies the gold standard there).. plus I am an avid Hyborian War player and the regular games have a big ‘mega alliance ‘ issue ) .   So there is a weakness in the format, potentially.  That said, you did hit a kingdom with defense pacts, and if a kingdom were to not live up to the agreement it would be a severe and public black mark on the players honor.

But at the same time the DE indicated that the IL hit him (claiming IL did so before their NAP expired).  The IL then blatantly lied about doing so.  Since the DE is one of our newer players and the IL is one of our most experienced players I thought to assist the DE by hitting the IL.

Woah! Hold your horses there buster. I did NOT do ANYTHING against the DE on Turn 20 nor did I break our NAP! That is an outright LIE! So don't start accusing people of lying on a public forum when you have no freakin' idea what you're talking about. I waited till Turn 21 before doing ANYTHING against the DE. If you want to hit me, fine, but don't go around making false claims against my person to justify your poor decisions.

[PTRILEY]

DE indicated that the IL hit him (claiming IL did so before their NAP expired).    

I think he said the DE claimed it?  Although he did say you lied, so in essence he took the DE account of the incident as fact over your account  of the incident ?  But he himself never said you did it, he only stated the DE said you did it,  No?

Necro the true presence of peace in our world..

[Diws]

Having played with IT in Alamaze and the DE player under his other avatar in Fall of Rome, I have trouble believing that either deliberately broke an accord. My guess is that there is an honest misunderstanding

Also my interpretation of defense pacts is that they are not binding if one of the pactees initiates conflict. Probably best to stipulate this when a pact is sealed, as I believe occurred in some cases in this game

[WARMASTER]

DE - WA

Hail noble Mage Lord!

I am attacked by the Illusionist. Our NAP just ended, and he is on the warpath!

I thought that it was the Dark Elf who attacked my city in the Eastern Steppes, but I suspect that it was actually the Illusionist who was behind it. If this is the case, he violated the terms of our agreement.

If you can help, then I ask you to do so.

Windstar, Lord of Demons.

???

[WARMASTER]

DE - WA

Hail noble Mage Lord!

I am attacked by the Illusionist. Our NAP just ended, and he is on the warpath!

I thought that it was the Dark Elf who attacked my city in the Eastern Steppes, but I suspect that it was actually the Illusionist who was behind it. If this is the case, he violated the terms of our agreement.

If you can help, then I ask you to do so.

Windstar, Lord of Demons.

Lord of Demons,
 I did NOTHING to your city in the Eastern Steppes, you need look elsewhere for answers there.  But given that our NAP is now over, however, you won't mind if do some redecorating?!

Lord of Illusions

???