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The main point of weakness with the DE is that the kingdom needs to possess a pop center in the region in order for submission/denegration to work. Pretty easy to neutralize once you find the pop center...
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(11-04-2015, 05:45 AM)Jumpingfist Wrote: I found the game I was thinking about and it was a 470 that got blocked at tolerant due to enemy declaration. Does not mean I do not think this is still basically a bug.
A note in the 470 is specific that you can not go above tolerant with an enemy or suspicious as a natural enemy.
The demon prince ability mentions you can not go above friendly but I think this is more just saying you can not make it any easier than friendly to take a PC. The ability does not mention it ignores ally/enemy or hint at it.
i really see no reason or logic on why the demon Princes should be allowed to ignor enemy. They get the benefit of ally but no henderance for enemy with the ability. If anything logic may say it would be even harder to raise the reaction level of an enemy kingdom since they are filling there controlled region of propaganda against the demon Prince.
The logic would be that it's magic - people are being convinced to believe something that they wouldn't ordinarily believe. So there's no reason that the normal enemy penalty would apply.
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Personally, I don't disagree with that. That's why my initial question was posed as an either/or, which takes precedence.
My opinion is that it's really unbalancing, however, and makes the AN/DE matchup pretty one-sided.
But EL is really powerful too, now, and 2nd Cycle is frozen, so no worries here. They are what they are.
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(11-04-2015, 11:20 PM)HeadHoncho Wrote: Personally, I don't disagree with that. That's why my initial question was posed as an either/or, which takes precedence.
My opinion is that it's really unbalancing, however, and makes the AN/DE matchup pretty one-sided.
But EL is really powerful too, now, and 2nd Cycle is frozen, so no worries here. They are what they are. Interesting. I'd take the AN over the DE any time.
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(11-05-2015, 04:37 AM)wfrankenhoff Wrote: (11-04-2015, 11:20 PM)HeadHoncho Wrote: Personally, I don't disagree with that. That's why my initial question was posed as an either/or, which takes precedence.
My opinion is that it's really unbalancing, however, and makes the AN/DE matchup pretty one-sided.
But EL is really powerful too, now, and 2nd Cycle is frozen, so no worries here. They are what they are. Interesting. I'd take the AN over the DE any time.
Yes, but not head to head....
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Being able to Demonic Submission a region to Friendly even after being declared Enemy is a major benefit, and one that makes me rethink the calculus on the entire Kingdom.
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Bring in and invisible brigade the same turn you launch your attack. Take a village military, use submission to friendly and if you have an extra DP even drop the owner off friendly for extra bonus. Being friendly you could even use ambassadors vs the villages.
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Phil had a couple favorite topics in the 20 years he ran Alamaze. One was talking about the balance among kingdoms, disparate as they were in strategic approach.
The other was how even after a decade or more of play, players would pick up new nuance, and generally learn something new every game.
Just looked at current Valhalla, for kingdoms. #6 is within 20% of #1. #11 is within 20% of #5. #15 is within 20% of #10.
The first PBM game I ever played was Earthwood. (That is why the developers of MEPBM say I can't moan about them ripping off Alamaze.) In that game, I think the last place kingdom was the Rangers, which had never done better than maybe 9th place. The difference between them and 1st place was like 10,000%. And there wasn't more than a few factors in that ancient game to differentiate kingdoms.
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(11-05-2015, 06:01 AM)Ry Vor Wrote: Phil had a couple favorite topics in the 20 years he ran Alamaze. One was talking about the balance among kingdoms, disparate as they were in strategic approach.
The other was how even after a decade or more of play, players would pick up new nuance, and generally learn something new every game.
Just looked at current Valhalla, for kingdoms. #6 is within 20% of #1. #11 is within 20% of #5. #15 is within 20% of #10.
The first PBM game I ever played was Earthwood. (That is why the developers of MEPBM say I can't moan about them ripping off Alamaze.) In that game, I think the last place kingdom was the Rangers, which had never done better than maybe 9th place. The difference between them and 1st place was like 10,000%. And there wasn't more than a few factors in that ancient game to differentiate kingdoms.
I guess I am saying that as a strategy game designer, while players play Alamaze today and they don't play Earthwood, so it remains a hobby for the discerning, to know when lavish design, and now coding effort, has been put into a game, as opposed to not knowing. I play tested a game for GSI (State of War) and it was incredible how simple a game it was, but how badly they missed the mark. There were three different units, and one 100 times the cost of the other, and 3 times the strength, with no mitigating factors. It's like, you don't want your in-law who might drink Ripple to gulp down your Kistler Chardonnay.
I admit to not having played the phone games like Forge of Empires, and their six or so sister games. Has anyone here, and what do you have to say about them?
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Lol, Alamaze was the first of this type of game I played and I was inspired to try others, including State of War. Boy, it sucked. I soon learned there was nothing like Alamaze on the market. So glad it's back.
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