# 502 Choosing Beta 1

[HeadHoncho]

I'm confused by the Siege Engineering trait. In particular, can you summarize the percentage chance of various people getting captured? Some of the below seems to overlap.

Bonus to laying siege: a town can be sieged in two turns (instead of 3). Enemy emissaries have a 20% lower chance of escaping during the 2nd or 3rd turn of a siege, and a 40% greater chance of being captured when the siege is completed. Declared enemy emissaries attempting to relocate from a population center under siege will undergo a 30% chance of capture (potentially modified by traits). Upon the successful completion of a siege all non-allied emissaries located within will undergo a 50% chance of capture. For kingdoms with Siege Engineering, the chances are 50% while under siege, and 70% upon successful completion. Towns and cities attacked (#150 or derivative orders like #160) by a kingdom with Siege Engineering have 10% subtracted from their defense. Any war machines they possess will give +15% to base combat strength in attacks.

[IMPERIAL_TARK]

Ahoy Mateys,
The Pirates are interested in trading for Food with any of the southern kingdoms. Do I have any takers?!
Capt. Blackjack

[Ry Vor]

I'm confused by the Siege Engineering trait.  In particular, can you summarize the percentage chance of various people getting captured?  Some of the below seems to overlap.

Bonus to laying siege: a town can be sieged in two turns (instead of 3). Enemy emissaries have a 20% lower chance of escaping during the 2nd or 3rd turn of a siege, and a 40% greater chance of being captured when the siege is completed. Declared enemy emissaries attempting to relocate from a population center under siege will undergo a 30% chance of capture (potentially modified by traits). Upon the successful completion of a siege all non-allied emissaries located within will undergo a 50% chance of capture. For kingdoms with Siege Engineering, the chances are 50% while under siege, and 70% upon successful completion. Towns and cities attacked (#150 or derivative orders like #160) by a kingdom with Siege Engineering have 10% subtracted from their defense. Any war machines they possess will give +15% to base combat strength in attacks.

Not sure what the question is.  The original rule contrasted the treatment in 2nd cycle from 3rd cycle, and someone recommended that be removed.  Basically, in 2nd Cycle, characters almost or did have a better chance to escape when the siege was successful, and had no problem leaving during the siege.  Now they have, if the sieging kingdom has Siege Engineering, a 50% chance of capturing emissaries attempting to relocate during the siege, and a 70% chance of getting them when the siege succeeds.

[Jumpingfist]

Before the final release I think if would be a good to go through and make the fleets match up more with the kingdom locations. I remember with the NO having ships in the sea of Terror. I believe the TY as well.

Also about sea patrols. Playing so many games I think I see trends likely faster than most anyone. I noticed in 2nd cycle the use of patrols on T1 becoming more frequent. Especially with kingdoms that start with quality 13 ships. These ships kill anything of lesser quality in the small number present on T1. An example of this is the EL vs WI. The WI has almost a 1/3 chance of there capital starting in the sea of terror they start with quality 12 ships the EL issues a patrol on turn 1 just to see if they can catch a wizard or some troops. The EL fleets eat up the WI fleets and have a good chance of killing there P4. Having no control over where your starting capital starts to me makes it almost unfair to not give everyone a chance to at least get there troops and wizards to dry land and still allow them to do the scouting that is really required on T1 if you plan to try and take the region early.
I was thinking about this with the pirate who could likely take out entire starting groups with sea patrols in every sea on turn 1. Likely not to happen in a diplomacy game but in a team or anon game very much so. I could easily see some of the glass jaw types quitting that game and possible Alamaze if they lost there 1xx group T1 after paying the start up fee to have there game ruined in there eyes.
I know the argument is to be careful if you start in the water but I think it is to critical in the first turn to afford that luxury. Anyway just my thought about maybe not allowing turn 1 patrols.

[Ry Vor]

There may be some adjustments to starting fleets, if the Nomad is starting with a fleet in Terror, for example. 

But there will also be changes in initial strategy.  JF writes:

"I noticed in 2nd cycle the use of patrols on T1 becoming more frequent. Especially with kingdoms that start with quality 13 ships. These ships kill anything of lesser quality in the small number present on T1. An example of this is the EL vs WI. The WI has almost a 1/3 chance of there capital starting in the sea of terror they start with quality 12 ships the EL issues a patrol on turn 1 just to see if they can catch a wizard or some troops. The EL fleets eat up the WI fleets and have a good chance of killing there P4."

If it were not that this was about ships in the Sea of Terror, I would think it just a fishing expedition for info.   

But what I see is actually, on Turn 0:

The EL has 2 fleets of quality 10 in Terror.

Then, in the Mists will be the capital of either the Cimmerian or Necromancer:
Cimmerian has 4 fleets of quality 13 and Sea Faring.
Necromancer has 2 fleets of quality 10.

Building a fleet takes place after movement, so if the Elves Sea Patrol he would be facing even odds if he succeeded in identifying the interdicting areas in the sea and the (Necro) moved through them, and also succeeded in the 60% chance to interdict. Whether he wins the sea battle or not, he is now at war with the Necro on T1.

If the Necro was still nervous, perhaps of Pirates, he could use Ship of Mist to move his group safely, and might consider constructing an Elite Ship to cross the sea in the future without having to teleport.

The main point being we will need to develop new strategies, and be more aware of our potential opponents.

[Ry Vor]

Here is what the regional summary in the first beta looks like after turn 5:

Regional Reaction Controlling

Region Influence Level Kingdom

Oakendell (1)   Elven
Northern Mists (2)  Cimmerians
Talking Mountains (3)  Warlock
Torvale (4)  Sorcerer
Amberland (5)  Sacred Order
Eastern Steppes (6)  Demon Princes
Runnimede (7)  Halfling
Arcania (8)  NA
Synisvania (9)  NA
Southern Sands (10)  Ancient Ones

[Jumpingfist]

There may be some adjustments to starting fleets, if the Nomad is starting with a fleet in Terror, for example. 

But there will also be changes in initial strategy.  JF writes:

"I noticed in 2nd cycle the use of patrols on T1 becoming more frequent. Especially with kingdoms that start with quality 13 ships. These ships kill anything of lesser quality in the small number present on T1. An example of this is the EL vs WI. The WI has almost a 1/3 chance of there capital starting in the sea of terror they start with quality 12 ships the EL issues a patrol on turn 1 just to see if they can catch a wizard or some troops. The EL fleets eat up the WI fleets and have a good chance of killing there P4."

If it were not that this was about ships in the Sea of Terror, I would think it just a fishing expedition for info.   

But what I see is actually, on Turn 0:

The EL has 2 fleets of quality 10 in Terror.

Then, in the Mists will be the capital of either the Cimmerian or Necromancer:
Cimmerian has 4 fleets of quality 13 and Sea Faring.
Necromancer has 2 fleets of quality 10.

Building a fleet takes place after movement, so if the Elves Sea Patrol he would be facing even odds if he succeeded in identifying the interdicting areas in the sea and the (Necro) moved through them, and also succeeded in the 60% chance to interdict. Whether he wins the sea battle or not, he is now at war with the Necro on T1.

If the Necro was still nervous, perhaps of Pirates, he could use Ship of Mist to move his group safely, and might consider constructing an Elite Ship to cross the sea in the future without having to teleport.

The main point being we will need to develop new strategies, and be more aware of our potential opponents.

My job to point out issues.   You can twist how you like.  I will consider this tactic fair play.  Odd that when I point out problems before they happen you brush them off but when I use them you "fix" them.

Actually why I am not posting many tips as well.  

[Jumpingfist]

UM.

Something odd from this last turn
I could not afford to use one of my priestess and it did not go through but on the activities of the Royal court section it says she did try an action. Not sure if she made a stamina check or not something to look into.

Oh something else to maybe check. Possible I just got lucky
I have 240ed two PC over the last few turns in my controlled region but did not loose a reaction level.

[unclemike]

Ran a few tests this morning with the orders submitted for today's turn and it looks ok. Just a note to the Sacred Order about their upcoming battle report, if you see something like this:

   "The large shields of the Westmen troops within the 1st Sacred Order reduced opposing missile damage."

That is not just flavor text but indicates a special effect of having Westmen troops in your group. Brigade-level special effects are a very real factor in battles so you may want to take them into consideration when building up your forces.

Same goes for other battle text like:

   "The {group name} force was enforced by the brute strength of the Apes among them in the forest."
      or
   "The Northmen of the {group name} effectiveness was improved due to being in a region affected by winter effects."

So have some fun outfitting your groups with different brigade types and their special effects. It could make a difference in battles...

[HeadHoncho]

Received 503 this morning, but oddly, not 502. (Because usually they're processed in order.)